Old Tarts Song / Ideologically Unsound / Crisis / Persons Unknown / Political Love / Jump Mama Jump
Good Times / S.S. Snoopers / Under The Doctor / Reality Attack / Bremen Song
Poison Girls were always great, and absolutely any excuse to upload them here on KYPP. This tape is mixing desk quality, but with ageing is not as crystal clear as it should be, but it is still pretty damn good. Not quite sure which Conway Hall gig it was, as they performed at the venue at least three times in 1979.
Great stuff as always from The Poison Girls. Indebted to Chris Low for the tape.
Collage from Impossible Dream fanzine.
tony b
April 29, 2008 at 10:43 pmChris,
did you tape this gig? if so what date was it?
i taped the first one at the conway hall.should still have somewhere.
also taped crass and epi-x that day too.plus all the soundchecks.
i was a geek.i got there at about 5pm.
TB
Penguin • Post Author •
April 29, 2008 at 10:55 pmThink this is a purchased tape. Do not think Chris was going to gigs in London in 1979. He was going to gigs in Glasgow and Edinburgh though.
Would rip yer arm off for your tapes though. If you find them I can put them up as one post – the whole gig plus soundchecks.
B.T.W. Which was the A.F.A. having a barney with B.M. gig Tony?
The one with The Epileptix or the one with The Rondos later on in the year?
If you find the tapes and are happy to lend them to me, perhaps we could meet up with Jim The Driver somewhere local?
Nic
April 30, 2008 at 8:08 amTony – it would be great to hear the cassette if you still have it: I too am a geek…
🙂
The heavy rumble with the B.M. at the Conway Hall was the concert with The Rondos on 8 September 1979 which was a benefit for ‘Persons Unknown’…
Penny Rimbaud (he of the vest with holes in it) remembers it as a case of The Rondos wanting to wind up the crowd and then legging it when the trouble kicked off – which he blames on the Left rather than the Right (I’m paraphrasing here)…
However, the Rondos guitarist told me he remembers it somewhat differently…
And I think – however – that ‘Crass’ may be slightly confused about dates too as I’m sure that the article in KYPP 1 by Crass makes reference to the gig played with the Epileptics…
I’m all confused!
By the way – great tape, Chris…I really love the Poison Girls early material: spikey, angular guitars and some great lyrics…
Can anybody enlighten me as to why they had a ‘fall out’ with Crass? Was it a case of who takes the top billing?
Nogsy
April 30, 2008 at 1:11 pmHi Guys,
thanks for this – Poison Girls were utterly fantastic – like you said Nic, that spikey angularity was totally infectious.
I was always fascinated by Richard’s dinky guitars – anybody know what blend they were – or did he, in a true DIY manner, make them himself?
I first saw them at the Sweatbox gig in Bradford (Crass and Annie – Aki from Violation, later SDC and some, arranged the gig). I scrounged a plectrum from Richard (excusable – I was only 14 or something).
About the the accompanying collage – is that one of Lance’s?
Questions questions.
Anyway, I too would love to hear any other live Girls stuff.
Keep ’em coming.
Many many thanks for the wonderful site.
Cheer, Nogsy
Mike
April 30, 2008 at 3:01 pmGreat tape.For some reason I wrote down a lot of the gigs I went to that year (1979),so Nic I’m gonna be even more nerdy as I dug out the old exercise book concerned:first Conway Hall gig I saw was Epileptics/P.Girls & Crass 26/5/79 (I even nicked the poster off the wall,still have it), then 25/8/79 same line-up plus Rubella Ballet.Next was the riot,but a week later Rubella Ballet and Poison Girls played there again,which was strange in light of all the trouble the week before.What I remember about the latter were a number of sheepish-looking skinheads with arms in slings, bruised faces.Then I have another listing for 14/3/80 which was Graph X/Sinyx/6 Minute War/Eratics/Straps/Epileptics,which I remember zilch about.I think at the time I was doing far too many little pills and too much booze, therefore writing it down was some vain attempt at posterity.
Somewhere inbetween all this was an aborted Satellites/Crass gig at Ealing Tech,a benefit for Blair Peach and smashed up by skinheads,who seriously demolished the place.I still see Del of the Satellites from time to time.Apparently most of the skins were local W.Ealing/Hounslow.Also,was one of the Crass-Conway Hall gigs on the same day as a Scots-England footie match,or did the tuinol/blues mash my memory up too much? The Conway Hall riot I DO remember a lot about (another time). Incidentally,Chris,Penguin or whoever uploads the tapes here,re:the Vex posting,if you wanna put up the Vex Electric Ballroom gig from 1984 that I have,let me know,it’s very good quality.I have loads of other stuff too:Fatal Microbes,Crisis,M.Romance/4th Reich, Pack,State Hate,Chaos,Ants,Eratics,Sears live,possibly even a Crass Conway Hall set,and a lot of stuff from bands I was in back then (Youth In Asia,Decadent Few etc).It’s all sitting here gathering dust except the occasional person I trade tape copies with,so would be nice to get some of it up on yer site
Penguin • Post Author •
April 30, 2008 at 5:03 pmMike, would be lovely to get some stuff up here from your collection, if you use the contact function above, Tony D will get the mail and give you my details. If you are N or E London based that would be a proper coup.
This tape above I will try to record again without dolby on, may make it slightly better sounding. Will compare anyhow.
tony b
April 30, 2008 at 6:15 pmYeah Mike,that was the right order alright…i was at the first two but not the one with the knuckle.(8th Sept 79:i thought i may have been at Slits at the Rainbow that night, release of ‘Cut’. But checked the date and it was 21st, Ants played Electric Ballroom that night too and Joy Div were on ‘Something Else’ at about 6pm on BBC2 before i went out. Dont fucking get saturdays like that no more!!)
Does the poster for May gig not say EPI-X on the poster? If it dont then i must have seen them at another Crass gig when they went under that name.
Another thing: I saw the Rondos with Crass.Are you sure there wasnt more than one Crass gig with Rondos at the Conway Hall..? I just remember when i saw them it seemd like they didnt fit with all the other bands. Were they not Dutch or something?
i got the flyer still for the Ealing College gig!!
There was also a Rock Against Communism gig at Conway Hall about that time too, pretty sure that is all overlooked in all this business with the fisticuffs gig. Sure thats how the two opposing factions may have come together.
Tapes…i’ll have to go look for em. Hilarious Conway Hall tape. I taped about half hour of soundcheck with Crass doing a few goes at banned from the roxy then stops halfway through with “can i have more guitar in me monitor” or whatever.i thought that was great. It was Crass!! about 4 minutes straight of “One-Two. One-Two. One-Two” No Shit! Hahahahaha This shit about Crass hiding like some bunch of fucking Bamber Gascoignes. Its crap. They were more than capable of handling troublemakers when it was needed and did so on more than one occasion (seen with my own eyes). They did what they had to when it was needed. I wasnt at that one so cant comment. But presumably it was out-of-fucking-control so they let them get on with it.
As usual with Crass:too many myths.
(I dont want to get into a pissing contest on here about who done what. So dont bother! Im a Grandfather who likes peace and quiet now! Hahaha Its bad enough we’re on here even telling these stories Hahahahah)
PS to Mike…im mates with Bill (QPR fan ,round glasses,squeeky high voice) he lives in portsmouth now..im seeing him tomorrow..i bet you know/knew him!!
tony b
April 30, 2008 at 6:30 pmPromise you guys that i’ll give you all first dabs the day i get in my lock up and get all the tapes out…
poison girls: piano lessons,hex,chappa…quality.i also for some reason taped them on a horrible wet midweek night in mid 81 at the moonlight round the time they had all those fantastic “Anarcho”(what else can you say) gigs there.They were superb and the tape is too.
i once said to Rimbaud at the Acklam Hall while watching the Poison Girls “this lot are shit arent they”
he said,calm as you like “i really like what they do,theyre different from us and thats good”
It was maybe first time in me life i stopped and thought “maybe i should look at things a bit more in depth and not just knee-jerk about stuff.I must’ve sounded like an idiot saying that”
Rimbaud was so cool,he werent going “shut up mate,you dunno what your talking about” he was really different.Like he actually gave a shit about you.As if at that moment there was only the two of you there.It felt strange cos you were used to school and being talked to by teacher shouting at 30 of you! Or your old girl shouting up the stairs “your dinners ready”,or your boss looking through you as he talked.First time someone of my age group spoke to me like that.
Just something i always remember about those days. Strange its stayed in me mind all this time.
tony b
April 30, 2008 at 6:34 pm“First time someone of my age group spoke to me like that.”
should read
“First time someone not of my age group spoke to me like that.”
Im not the same age group as Rimbaud!(who was older than my dad when i spoke to him.It seemd Mental at the time.But inspiring too.)
Sorry Pen! Hahahaha
Nic
April 30, 2008 at 7:11 pmThe Rondos definitely only played Conway Hall once (on the 8 September 1979): it was the only concert they ever played in the United Kingdom…
(Keep the thoughts coming, tonyb… 🙂 All good stuff…)
luggy
April 30, 2008 at 8:31 pmMike, any chance of getting hold of any unreleased Satellites stuff, preferably before the keyboard was added?
Saw them loads & would love to hear them again. Lost my live tape from Acton Town Hall years ago. Nice to hear Del’s still with us.
Penguin • Post Author •
April 30, 2008 at 8:50 pmOK as I thought, I have rerecorded this tape with dolby off and it sounds much better now. If you have downloaded it already, then do so again. It is worth it.
Nic
May 1, 2008 at 7:42 amMike – I will second any requests for your tapes…
🙂
It would be nice to hear the State Hate, Crisis, Fatal Microbes and Youth In Asia (I had one of your Nelliephant badges as a 13 year old)…
I would love to have been at the The Sinyx / Six Minute War gig: I only saw the Sinyx once (1982 at Centro), but Six Minute War were really inspirational for me at the time (D.I.Y., et al) and I’ve always had a soft spot for them)…
It would be really interesting to hear your thoughts on the Conway Hall pugilism as well…
Incidentally, you may be interested to know that my friends mum and step-dad were in Antisocial…
We used to use his step-dads effects pedals to make ‘Power Electronics’ back in 1983, hehehe…
His mum is as wild as ever, and still comes out when he plays a local gig…
🙂
Mike
May 1, 2008 at 4:20 pmPenguin/Luggy/Nic:I’ve sent my email address to Tony D so grab it off him and drop me a line.Luggy,I have a couple of Satellites live tapes and a demo,not sure of year but def. no keyboards on the live ones.One is at Malvern and they get thrown off after 5-6 songs for ‘swearing too much’,v.funny.A friend has a ’79 one from Acton w/Chaos on the other side,one Sunday I’m going round there to dig it out from his chaotic pile. Penguin:I’m in SW London-Fulham/Kings Rd area so I’m sure we can sort something out.Nic:was that the skinhead Anti Social or the Brummie lot that advertised for a prospective suicide to kill themselves onstage with them (cue Daily Mirror Punk shocker outrage stories!)? Tony B:you should really dig those old tapes of yours out! I’ll check that Crass poster and see if it mentions Epi-x.Yeah,I know Bumnote Bill:Land Of Treason right? say hello to him from Mick of Decadent Few.Small world.The Crass gig at Ealing was a disaster,the skins started wrecking the place as the Satellites finished,but the violence didn’t start until the police brought in dogs.I do remember Penny Rimbaud forlornly announcing ‘We’ll play if you clear up the damage’,which of course never happened.About the Crass Conway Hall riot,I was talking to Sid of Rubella Ballet about this last year and he was stood near me when some skinhead said to his mate ‘As soon as Crass come on,lay into the nearest punk’.When it all erupted and people made for the side doors,this skinnyhead(w/pork pie hat) was the first one out:he ran like streaked lightning up the road,never to be seen again. Seems like it was a bunch of SWP types who came in and jumped the skins,all I remember was the sound of screaming and people scattering in all directions.I was talking to the Hayes mob (Slim,Womble,Eddie No-Neck, Weave et al) when someone put a chair over Slim’s back,but he was a such a big guy he shrugged it off,turned and grabbed his attacker by the throat.It was like a cartoon.I had taken up a couple of much younger local punky kiddies,whose mums I’d promised ‘don’t worry,Crass gigs are safe’. Famous last words! It’s true tho’,Crass never hid from the trouble and were more than capable of sticking up for themselves.A funny Crass story told to me by Ickenham Andy:walking through Kings X or some other big London station,there’s Penny holding a large pot plant.Eyes meet,Penny shrugs “There goes my street credibility then”.I’m off before this turns into a novel…
Chor
May 1, 2008 at 6:15 pmive just looked through my tapes and i have crass conway hall 26.5.79
got the soundcheck on it aswell if you want to put it up on here? let me know
Nic
May 1, 2008 at 6:36 pmIt’s the ‘shock rock’ Antisocial of ‘Traffic Lights’ fame, Mike…
🙂
chris
May 1, 2008 at 9:17 pmand who was the Power Electronics act that used the pedals, Nic?
PS: Found that Bible of Sins tape.
tonyb
May 2, 2008 at 11:49 amMike: Saw Bill last nite in Southampton…mentioned you.I’ll mention Dec Few that’ll do it. He brought geezer called John from Satalites out one nite about a year ago…Sid, once when we played with Dirt in Stepney,all the local herberts decided to do all the punx as they were queing up to go in.They steamed in from council estate across the road in to the queue.One of my mates got stabbed in the back with a broken bottle.Sid, on the other hand,picked up a paving slab(i used to pave the street for Haringay in the 80s,i know how much they weigh) and threw it literally across the entire two lanes of road at the lot of em!! Hahaha superb.
Rondos:cant figure out why i think i saw em cos i def werent at that one with the barney.Weird that my mind is going along with my eyes and hair after all this time. hahahahaha
Chor:You should stick that Conway hall tape up for a laugh.I bet that 20 minutes of “One-two” is the nuts!! Hahaha
Nic
May 3, 2008 at 9:05 amThe ‘Power Electronics’ project was called Final, Chris…
It was the main project of Justin Broadrick (ex-Napalm Death / Head of David, ex-Godflesh, now Jesu) at the time, and it also included myself along with other collaborators…
We appeared on tape compilations with people like Ramleh and The Unkommuniti (the group of Tim Gane of Stereolab)…
Some of the recordings came out on CD about 15 years ago…
And someone else recovered a box of tapes from his loft about 6 months ago so there may be another release in the future…
I am – as they say in the colonies – ‘stoked’ that you’ve fund a Bible of Sins tape!
Mike
May 3, 2008 at 1:29 pmTony:found that Crass poster,it’s a stencilled one:Crass/P.Girls/ Autopsy, 26th May,Peace News Benefit.No mention of Epileptics but sure they played.It has the circled A with broken tommy-gun at the bottom,oh and it was a quid entry (a quid?! the temerity of them!).I have a feeling I nipped under the tables in the entrance hall whilst the hippy on the door was distracted,then pinched the poster off the wall to boot on the way out.What a devil I was.I also found another one for Reading Town Hall in May (year?) and a Merry Crassmas/Bollocks to Xmas poster,plus the flier handed out after the Conway Hall riot (the following week maybe) where they slag off the SWP,the Guardian etc. Nic:you may wanna check out that ‘Bored Teenagers’ website,there’s a whole bit about Anti Social,seems the author of the site went to a lot of effort to find ex-members with no luck.Incidentally, I have tape of Waxwork Dummies/Flux/Sinyx at Action Space in 1980:anyone got the 6 Minute War from the same night?
Chris
May 4, 2008 at 1:02 amNic: Bizarre! I’m meant to be getting a project together with gary of Ramleh shortly. Also a couple of years ago I had a practice with The Projects which featured ex-stereolab members, though my drumming was too ‘heavy’ for them haha.
Swap you the Final CD for a copy of the Bible of Sins tape?? Also, if you’re in touch with The Rondos’ drummer, have you ever asked him about that ‘Red Rock Collective’ documentary?
Tony: I’d imagine if The Rondos came over they would have played more than one gig in London over that period? Does anyone remember a band calld ‘Amsterdamned’ – i’m sure i’ve still got a tape of them at either Wapping or the Centro. I think Andy martin described them as ‘trying to be like the Sex Pistols’ but I remember quite liking what I heard.
Any chance of scanning that post-Conway Hall Crass ‘statement’ – would be good for the re-print of Martin’s ‘Anti-fascist’ book. I’ve still got the copy of Time Out that has a large piece on the Conway hall ruck (plus a persons Unknown defendants’ interview) so will send that to Micky.
Would love to hear a live tape of Six Minute War. Was always a ‘holy grail’ for me “back in the day” but the nearest I got was a tape of Fallout which i’ll have to try to unearth sometime.
Didn’t members of SDC/Bauhaus influenced Waxwork Dummies form Special Duties or something equally bizarre? Have a strange recollection of this or some connection at least…
AL Puppy
May 4, 2008 at 8:51 amChris- Amsterdammed played Centro Iberico Sunday 2nd May 1982 – along with Conflict, Rubella Ballet, The Apostles and the Assassins of Hope. Over 500 people turned up but only 400 could squeeze in. After the bands got payed, the grand total of £35 was left. Info from KYPP 5.
The Crass and Poison Girls statement, issued in November 1979 is in KYPP 1. Given the confusion over sequence of events, here are first lines:
Right/here we are again, out on the street/ the second time a Conway Hall gig has been cancelled and for us, the last time/ we’ve played three gigs here / arranged six /one fucked up /two cancelled/ count one that never even got beyond the planning stage/ [that makes]7…
The statement goes on to say that after two weeks discussion about employing security “we had decided to do so to prevent people from the kind of attack that occurred last time.”
Statement also reveals that it was a series of demands made by the GLC [Greater London Council – licensing authority] on the Conway Hall that led to the cancellation.
Also this “Rather than being broken up by the BM as reported in most papers, our last gig at the Conway Hall was stopped by a group claiming SWP affiliation… ”
Also gives Crass ‘position’ on Rock Against Racism…
It is three pages long and is on this site in KYPP 1 which is in ‘Photos’ section.
Nic
May 4, 2008 at 9:46 amChris – I asked Allie (Rondos) and they definitely only played a single gig in London: I have a list of the gigs somewhere and it is definitely the only one…
I’m going to send you a ‘proper’ email soon (I’ve just met a few deadlines and have a bit of a breather), and we’ll get some ‘swapsies’ on the go…
I used to have a cassette copy of an Amsterdamned gig from London – I seem to remember that it was at the Centro (I got it from that guy in Kent, Chris)…
I know the ‘Bored Teenagers’ site, Mike: some great stuff (for nerds!)…I should perhaps get in touch with them…
The drummer of Waxwork Dummies joined Special Duties…
I have a copy of the Waxwork Dummies demo somewhere…
Mike
May 5, 2008 at 1:48 pmI checked properly (must be my eyesight…),the Crass flyer starts ‘Since our last London gig,the abortive Conway Hall…’ and ends ‘Left Wing Right Wing you can stuff the lot’,it’s one page.The other is a 2-sided thing given out at the Zigzag gig (background to ‘todays event’.Also found a 2/3 page ‘zine-type handout given out on entry to a Flux/Antisect gig at Fulham Greyhound,year 1982 maybe?? plus a poster Crass/P.Girls/Charge May 11th at N.London Poly,Holloway Rd.Maybe 1979?
Waxwork Dummies I remember as being dressed in Red Indian-style warpaint,singer had a big stick/staff he was pounding on the stage, they had a lot of mates dressed likewise dancing around.They also did Chat’s Palace later in year w/Flux & Funeral Directors,whoever they were.
Nic
May 5, 2008 at 2:47 pmFlux / Antisect definitely played Fulham Greyhound in 1983, so it’s probably then…
I believe that the Funeral Directors were a local Hackney band who had a track on the ‘Hackney Musicians Collective’ compilation LP (that came out in 1980?)…
chris
May 6, 2008 at 10:05 amNic, wasn’t it Funeral Directors Ian (Slaughter) was asking about on the Crass forum? If anyone has any further info on them please post it up here as a mate of mine was trying to track them down.
danmac
May 6, 2008 at 10:52 amwaxwork dummies and crew were from chelmsford. singer called mole?
met the funeral directors a few times going to and from various gigs and saw em at chats palace tho i dont think they were from hackney. they were a comedy proto-goth band and for some reason (they’re rather amusing) these lyrics of theirs have always stuck in my head:
(to be sung/spoken in a cod boris karloff voice)
i’m so uncanny
i killed my granny
and now she’s dead and in my bed
i don’t have to hear her trani…
hello mike – how are you? been a long time. hope all’s well….
Mike
May 6, 2008 at 11:42 amIs that Dan of Book Of Revelations/Apostles fame? how are you mate? indeed a long time.You still in London?
Yeah,Waxwork Dummies were from Chelmsford,singers name was Molde I think.I wonder if Adam & Ants nicked the Native American (to be PC) stuff off them ?.
Great lyrics, reminds me of TSOL (American band) LP which had words in a similar tho’ more sophisticated (‘I’m pyromania,I’m Transylvania.I’m out of breath,I’m worse than death’ have stuck in my head)
danmac
May 7, 2008 at 9:06 amall good mike – still in london but i moved to the southern half of the metropolis…traitor that i am. hows about yourself? i take it that you escaped from the clutches of the royal mail or are you now king of the posties?
waxwork dummies were doing their indigenous north american peoples sound before adam and sdc weren’t they. thought they were quite good in a hooliganindian kind of way.
Mike
May 7, 2008 at 10:15 amDan:you have the memory of an elephant,I was only a postman for a year. Managed to get in on time once:my last day.Got a written warning which the union got rescinded (somehow,I didn’t have a leg to stand on), dunno if you could get away w/it nowadays.The pub next door was full of postmen officially ‘on the sick’ but able to get to the bar every lunchtime, hilarious.I was going to gigs,getting home at 2/3am then was supposed to get into the PO for 5am.No chance.Been all over since,NELP/Virgin/Rough Trade warehouse in Collier St. near Kings X.Where are you now,Peckham?
danmac
May 7, 2008 at 10:40 amthe glamorous world of the music industry – good stuff. i’m living the dream in peckham working with a load of health projects down here – more enjoyable than it might appear on the box. however, do they know anything at all about the waxwork dummies? do they fuck…their loss mate, their loss…
Mike
May 7, 2008 at 12:02 pmYes,it was good whilst it lasted-Rough Trade/Virgin/Caroline et al,v.lax compared the general drab 9-5 world,but sadly that gravy train has long gone now the ‘kids want downloads’ as they say.Good to hear you’re well. I was in Peckham for a year or 2 in 1990-2,Lyndhurst Way near the old Walmer Castle (which has been renamed?).If I remember,the W.Castle hosted the 4 Skins and a few other Oi type gigs back in early 80s,but enough of that.Decadent Few played there once,at the insistence of a drummer we had,Paul from Deptford (Assault,Acid Drops & Intrusion zine). It was with some soul band and the PA was like a couple of tiny speakers, you could actually hear the clink of beer glasses above the music,terrible!
Graham Burnett
May 14, 2008 at 1:09 am> I would love to have been at the The Sinyx / Six Minute War gig: I only saw the Sinyx once (1982 at Centro), but Six Minute War were really inspirational for me at the time (D.I.Y., et al) and I’ve always had a soft spot for them)…
Funny our different perspectives – Sinyx were local boys to me so used to see them practically every week, more often than not at the ‘Focus’ youth centre, where there would usually be the usual 30 or so pogo-ing punks and indifferent soul boys drinking pop, smoking fags, impressing girls in Ra ra skirts and playing pool… We’d also all hang out in the same pubs, in the high street outside W H Smiths etc. We (Autumn Poison) actually did a gig with 6 Minute War once, although they’d changed their name to Fallout by then. The gig was arranged by Steve Pegrum of Kronstadt Uprising, another band of almost legenedary anarcho-status but just lads from the high street to us… http://www.southendpunk.com/html/artwor21.html
Lots more classic posters of local gigs including Sinyx, Kronstadt, and indeed the Clash gig at the Chancellor hall in Chelmsford that inspired Crass here – http://www.southendpunk.com/html/memorabi.html