A message from Andy Martin of The Apostles

Andy Martin 3rd EP session

I assume the ‘Ian S’ is Ian Slaughter? If so then ‘hello Ian’. Any comment here purporting to come from me I actually have to send via e-mail to Andus first because I am unable to contribute to sites like these for technological reasons. There have been 2 or 3 people sent out greetings to me on this site but they’ve not left their e-mail addresses so I couldn’t respond to them even if I wanted to. I only see excerpts from this site when Andus sends them to me – usually when there’s some stupid argument about who played what instrument in The Creeping Nobodies in 1983 and which audience member stole their glue bag etc. It’s bizarre reading comments by people discussing The Apostles when I had forgotten about all that crap by 1990. This doesn’t apply to you, Ian, but it’s such a pain having to use Andus to post these comments I’ll say it here as I’m hardly going to be a regular contributor to this thing. So, for the record: punk died in the 1980s. The 1980s are gone and they’re not coming back. Punk is dead and it’s not coming back. Instead of droning on and on about what you did in the 1980s and who hit who at this or that gig, why not concentrate on what’s happening NOW and THINK AHEAD! Just a thought.

In case anyone else out there wants to release Apostles stuff on vinyl or CD – fine but please ask Dave Fanning first, purely out of politeness and common courtesy. For myself, I think ALL the tracks we’ve ever released should be available as free downloads. If I had my way, UNIT would no longer release CDs – they waste natural resources anyway – but the artwork and music tracks would be issued purely as digital downloads FOR FREE since that way our music is no longer a part of the capitalist commodity exchange. Never mind about that hoary old argument ‘oh but then you won’t make any money from sales of your music’ well we don’t make any bloody money from sales of our CDs anyway so who cares? If I want to make a profit, I work overtime or find another job – music, art and literature should all be free.

Also, thanks to the excerpts Andus sends me from this site, I have now counted no less than 4 occasions when poor Penguin The Peacemaker has had to jump in like a referee with ’steady on, chaps, keep it civil’ type messages. Penguin, referees are generally paid damned good wages – so you should start charging KYPP a decent fee.

If anyone wants to have a go at me (they usually do) then it’s no good posting angry retorts on this site (unless you want to see how long it takes for Penguin to leap in with ‘come on, folks, calm down, keep it friendly’), instead you can pester me at unitunited@yahoo.com.


Penguin, you may copy and make available for FREE DOWNLOAD any tracks by UNIT on your site. Forget The Apostles, they were crap, they were for the 1980s, they aren’t relevant any more and, be honest, we really weren’t very good – the only half decent musician we had in the band was Chris Low and by the time I’d finished ‘mixing’ the tracks you couldn’t hear what the poor sod was playing anyway – hear the tracks done properly with UNIT, especially as nearly half the tracks recorded by UNIT don’t even have me on them (which is probably why they sound so good).
The same goes for any artwork – bung it all on there, whatever you like – but I think if you’re going to make Time To Think available then you could warn people that UNIT material does NOT sound like that, i.e. it is recorded properly in a professional recording studio and that I am never allowed anywhere near the mixing desk so everyone can expect a decent production job!
  1. John No Last Name
    John No Last Name
    January 2, 2009 at 11:38 pm

    “Some Nazi Dude who tried to sell the hippies guns” …hmm now from trying to decipher this from all of your musings on this post are you talking about Barack Obama or Andy Martin with this reference?

  2. johng
    January 2, 2009 at 11:43 pm

    Barack Obama has a connection with arms dealing?

  3. andus
    January 3, 2009 at 1:50 am

    What a doss.

  4. Ian S
    Ian S
    January 3, 2009 at 1:45 pm

    If someone had got killed, it would have made the news no problem. But no copper would have got done for the killing, they always get let off, take early retirement, go and run a pub or guesthouse somewhere.

  5. Stewart
    January 3, 2009 at 9:40 pm

    John no last name – lol, you could be right…

    Chris and Andus – I agree, get a room…

    PS Having watched all 10 parts of Spirit of Albion, I’m still confused – were the hippies really evil demons with supernatural powers and pointy teeth, and was Stonehenge really the ancient equivalent of a car wash, only the rollers have decayed over time, or what???? Or was I watching the wrong film? And where does Captain Birdseye come into it?

  6. Graham Burnett
    Graham Burnett
    January 3, 2009 at 10:35 pm

    I never heard of anybody getting killed at the battle of the Beanfield before.

  7. Penguin
    Penguin • Post Author •
    January 4, 2009 at 1:02 am

    Roger that Graham, sure I would have heard about a death while the plod were busting up transport and more importantly, HOMES, for many dozens of people during that tragic couple of days.
    We must remember the pregnant women at the scene though, and I am sure they were a few, and what may have become of them and the unborn babies within them during all this turmoil. Hopefully nothing, but you never know…

    How you doing Stewey? Still good I hope…is everything fine with you and yours?

  8. Graham Burnett
    Graham Burnett
    January 4, 2009 at 4:11 am

    Well yes, I was very much in ‘the scene’ at that time, with alot of crossover with the traveller community as we spent alot of time at Molesworth peace camp throughout 84 and 85 (never actually lived or stayed there but was part of the support network and visited on regular basis and got to know alot of the folks who went on to become part of the peace convoy via Southend CND), also got to know people like Sid Rawle, John Pendragon, etc, who were spokespersons of the Travellers, plus was very up with the non-aligned and alternative media (Black Flag, Freedom, Class War, Peace News, Green Anarchist, etc, etc, etc) as well as deep involvement with the general anarcho-scene who would certainly have broadcast anything that significant, but never heard even a rumour along those lines. My partner’s sister also became a so-called ‘new age traveller’ around that time (actually a year or 2 later, but would still be au fait with the events and those involved) and so was very much a part of that network, and very much caught the sharp end of Thatcher’s publically stated intention to ‘make life as difficult as possible for these people’, but despite all the horrors she experienced and witnessed at the hands of the Authorities she never to the best of my knowledge heard about any deaths at the Battle of the Beanfield, although that was probably as much by luck than judgement (and as you rightly state penguin, who knows what happened to some of the pregnant women who were violently attacked, not to mention the PTSD many must have suffered). I think what happened there was horrendous enough and doesn’t need any exageration, the facts are well enough documented, in fact the propagation of unsubstantiatable rumours actually detracts from the implications of what happened that day and what the police/state are capable of, once reality starts to get muddied by rumour and exageration it becomes easier to discredit the voices that speak our truths, witness the fracas that have broken out here on this message board, never mind in the wider arenas of media that people actually pay attention to. Making unsubstantiated claims about deaths at the beanfield make it easier to dismiss the whole thing as the invention of a few stoned hippies living in trucks with no MOTs, and fuck it, it was 24 years ago so who gives a shit anyway…

  9. Val
    January 4, 2009 at 12:40 pm

    Hi I just wanted to share my personal experience of how the ‘myth’ of travellers having guns, that was being peddled by the tabloids at the time, translated into very real danger. My truck got trashed in Hackney (no major damage, just VERY scary), in summer 86 on the night of one of the royal weddings (possibly Andy and Fergie?), by a gang of lads back from the pub, in plastic union jack hats (which was beyond surreal). I was parked outside Tony and Cravat’s squat (can’t remember the name of the road) and had gone to bed in the truck early as I was preggers at the time, taking the dog with me. When the drunken likely lads came by, making a bit of a racket, the dog started barking and this drew their attention to the truck. Unfortunately there was a skip full of builder’s rubble and timber nearby, so they started pelting the truck with bricks and etc, shouting about “those hippies with their dogs and guns” as justification.

    Fortunately, someone called the police, who came and saved the day! Oh, the irony!

  10. Graham Burnett
    Graham Burnett
    January 4, 2009 at 2:37 pm

    Not the brightest bunch of lads if they really did believe that you had guns in your truck…

  11. chris
    January 4, 2009 at 4:32 pm

    QUOTE: I think what happened there was horrendous enough and doesn’t need any exageration, the facts are well enough documented, in fact the propagation of unsubstantiatable rumours actually detracts from the implications of what happened that day and what the police/state are capable of, once reality starts to get muddied by rumour and exageration it becomes easier to discredit the voices that speak our truths, witness the fracas that have broken out here on this message board, never mind in the wider arenas of media that people actually pay attention to. Making unsubstantiated claims about deaths at the beanfield make it easier to dismiss the whole thing as the invention of a few stoned hippies…

    The most important point and very well put; Graham – The Voice of Reason!

    And sorry to hear of that terrifying experience, Val. Unfortunate they had chosen Hackney, rather than the Gaza Strip, to throw stones at a van.

  12. Stewart
    January 4, 2009 at 4:51 pm

    Hi Penguin! Miscarried, sadly, but not unexpectedly… I’ll just have to wait for unknown children in unknown places to somehow miraculously track me down and shout ‘Dad!’…

    And I agree with Graham!

    Anyway, time to move on peeps… So answer me this question, which I’ve been wondering about for years: Were The Apostles the first transexual band or was that Wayne County? And what bra size was Andy/Andi anyway?

  13. Penguin
    Penguin • Post Author •
    January 4, 2009 at 5:56 pm

    Sorry to hear that Stewey…my thoughts are with you.

  14. Phil R
    Phil R
    January 4, 2009 at 6:14 pm

    Hi Stew sorry to hear that..Hope you both make a quick recovery.

    And yes..I agree with Graham…after living on the road between 88-95 I experienced how scary the police could be, at some points I could hardly believe what was happening..They where so heavy handed! And thats coming from someone who lived in loads of Punk squats throughout the 80’s(places like Campbell Buildings!)
    And to answer your question about Andy and Wayne I remember them discussing punk in a cafe at the Nags Head in 1978 and Wayne was the only one taking the hormones at the time..to my knowledge.

  15. chris
    January 11, 2009 at 4:01 am

    Nic? Penguin? Mr Burnett? Anyone else who can help? Just came across this singularly intriguing cassette release on discogs – http://www.discogs.com/Various-In-The-Old-Days-No-7/release/1562017 – anyone know anything about it, or better still own a copy?

    (NB: have reposted this here as the more apt thread takes ages to load as it’s so bloody long!)

  16. Nic
    January 11, 2009 at 12:09 pm

    It’s still available from BBP, Chris…

  17. andy martin
    andy martin
    January 16, 2009 at 11:48 am

    “We’ve almost finished collecting together all the old Apostles tracks required for remastering onto CD and digital format (downloads, i-pods, MP3s, alien telepathic links etc) but a few we have still be unable to trace. Has anyone copies the following three Apostles tracks they can send to us?

    Imagine Think Dream. Four Small Worlds. Glass, Shells & Cars.

    If anyone out there can assist us in this, please contact us at unitunited@yahoo.com. Thanks.”

  18. chris
    January 19, 2009 at 3:16 pm

    finalised tracklisting for:


    from 1st EP:
    HELLO BLACK FLAG (previously unreleased, recorded at 1st EP recording session)

    from 2nd EP:

    from 3rd EP:

    from 5th EP:
    MOB VIOLENCE (unreleased, complete version)

    (unreleased studio version of the early Apostles track, recorded at 2nd EP session, vocals by Larry Peterson)

    THE PHOENIX Pts 1 & 2
    (unheard original studio version of this unreleased tracks, recorded at the 2nd EP session)

    (all songs studio remastered from ORIGINAL studio cassettes)


  19. Nic
    January 19, 2009 at 6:25 pm

    I was wondering Chris: what dictated the selection of certain songs and not others – for example, the missing songs from the 3rd EP?

  20. Graham Burnett
    Graham Burnett
    January 20, 2009 at 12:52 am

    No album tracks? Or is this another project. i’d like to hear a decent version of Workers Autonomy complete with the jaunty little instrumental bit on the end, and also The Hunt (I think) that was a total plagiarism of Thin Lizzie’s ‘Emerald’

  21. Chris
    January 20, 2009 at 11:57 pm

    Nic: the reason only two tracks from the 3rd EP are represented on this CD is very simply because even on my original master cassette recorded straight from the mixing desk in Recession Studios the sound quality is so irredeemably shit, the studio technician who was remastering the stuff said that basically you could send the songs to the audio analysists who identified the gunshots on recordings of the Kennedy assassination “but they would still sound shit”. The two ‘title’ tracks have been included and every possible improvemnt has been made to their sound. Also, simply due to time constraints I thought it best to concentrate on the songs people had told me they wanted to hear remastered whereas noone had ever really requested any of those which have been omitted (mainly instrumental tracks). Whereas about EVERYONE told me ‘Hello Black Flag’ was among the songs they most wanted to hear a decent version of and many were surprised to even KNOW that a studio version of the classic “Hello Mark” had ever been recorded.

    Graham: I’ve got nothing to do with any album tracks, best to email Andy bout that, mate.

  22. grim
    November 26, 2009 at 3:31 am

    This has to be the funniest thread I can find anywhere on KYPP.

    Bunch of hippies getting beaten up in a field is turned into a massive conspiracy involving deaths etc? I knew plenty of people who were there that day – and it is only here that I’ve heard any rumour of a death.

    Maybe someone died afterwards from an OD? There were certainly a lot of heavy drug users involved with The Convoy.

    What also struck me about The Convoy is that large elements of them were pure free market capitalists and had much more in common with Thatcher than both sides would’ve cared to admit.

  23. seitan
    December 6, 2009 at 6:24 pm

    whatever happened to the apostles cds on bbp, cos i mailed gogs and he never replied, and i couldnt find anything on his website.
    anybody know anything?

  24. chris
    December 18, 2009 at 2:55 am

    Andy would be the chap to ask I’d imagine. I know he did digitise all the old cassettes and do covers for them.

  25. John Eden
    John Eden
    December 18, 2009 at 10:40 am

    any news on the Apostles reissues, chris?

  26. chris
    December 18, 2009 at 1:57 pm

    It’s only the remastered early singles (plus extra studio tracks from EP sessions) i’ve got anything to do with. Things been put on hold as I had to return to Scotland to look after my old dear and use the money I had put aside for the CD to help her out but, by coincidence, only today I heard some promising news re the project so shall keep you informed.

    Haven’t a scooby-doo what’s happened to the BBP re-issues. Nothing to do with me folks!

  27. John Eden
    John Eden
    December 18, 2009 at 5:54 pm

    Thanks Chris, sorry to hear about your family troubles.

  28. seitan
    December 18, 2009 at 9:17 pm

    ok, i thought you, chris were working together with gogs.
    please keep us posted on the remastered early 7″s 🙂

  29. chris
    December 19, 2009 at 2:48 pm

    Will do mate.
    Regarding the reissues of the DEMOS I think Andy is the man to ask about all that. I can’t wait to hear digitised versions of the first four demos myself.

  30. Simon Break
    Simon Break
    June 15, 2010 at 7:55 am

    Hi Chris –

    I think you’re being a bit unfair to “andus”. Just because you can’t find something on Google or are a bit hazy on the details doesn’t mean it never happened. For example, I can clearly remember around the mid-80s everybody talking about this radical mercenary group, these four guys who got framed by the US government and had to go underground. They would help out oppressed communities against the authorities, solve violent crimes etc. They even made their own vehicles out of scrap metal, like our own crusty community! The fascist authorities were only further enraged by the fact they had an African-American member (One Love brother! Unite and Fight!) as Black and White joining together in the cause of revolution could clearly not be tolerated!

    Needless to say, the powers that be ensured that all mention of this group was omitted from the MSM, yet somehow everybody knew of them and their audacious anti-establishment operations. As I say I can’t find anything about them on Wikipedia and have only the fuzziest recollection of the exact details, but I feel quite sure that the information I received from a number of knowledgeable individuals in the school playground was essentially correct. Sometimes a half-remembered anecdote from decades ago told to you by someone whose name escapes you can carry more weight than any amount of so-called “research”.


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